Interview: Singapore Coach Radojko Avramovic

Former Notts County and Coventry City goalkeeper Radojko ‘Raddy” Avramovic has been the boss of Singapore's national team since 2003. The Serbian has led the nation to success in Tiger Cups and is now getting ready to lead them to the 2010 World Cup. The third round of qualification starts next month with Saudi Arabia, Uzbekistan and Lebanon standing between Singapore and a place in the fourth and final stage.

You played for Nottingham County from 1979-82. At the time, Nottingham Forest were the champions of Europe. How was it being in the city at the time?

I was one of the first foreigners to play in England. It was a good time to be there. The people were fanatic about football and Notts County reached what is now called the Premier League. At the time, Nottingham Forest were a great team with Brian Clough as the manager and a team full of internationals. It was great to be there.

The football scene in Nottingham is not so healthy these days…

Many things have changed. If you don’t adapt and change with them then you have problems and that is what you have with Nottingham Forest. Maybe they were sleeping on their past success and didn’t change. Now it’s hard to get back what they had before.

Do you ever go back to watch Notts County?

Nearly every year I go to Nottingham. I have many friends there and I am very happy that people haven’t forgotten me. They also chose me as a legend of Notts County and I am very proud of that.

Not many goalkeepers become coaches. Do you think there is a reason for that?

I don’t know. To become a coach is very hard work and you have to make many sacrifices and not many people are prepared to do that.

Moving forward… You have just signed an extension to your contract. You have been with Singapore since 2003. You must have seen many changes.

I first came to Asia in 1991 and went to Oman until 1998. Then I took Kuwait to the Sydney Olympic Games. The whole country was delighted as not many teams from Asia go to the Olympics. Then I took over the Kuwait National team and we won the West Asian Games. In 2003 I came to Singapore.

Have you never been tempted to go anywhere else? Have you had any offers?

I have had a few offers. But when I came to Singapore, the team was in bad shape. There was a need for lots of improvement and the Singapore FA supported me. We have done well –not just me but the federation and the players.

I have built a team here and we have achieved a lot but now we need to really make international results. These days in Kuwait and Oman, there are players in the national team that I selected when I was there – young boys. In Singapore it is time to make results with the hard work we have put in over the last four years or so.

Some of the national team players were born overseas and have become naturalized citizens. They now play for Singapore. This has been criticised by many...

It is not as simple as many people say, they don’t know what they are talking about. If you look at Europe, there are so many players from all over the world.

In Singapore there are two cases. The first is that some players have spent all their lives in Singapore. The second case is that some people come here to play football, live six or seven years, get married, have kids and want to live their life in Singapore. They get the passport without any involvement from the FA.

And then there are young players that come here. We follow them and if they have potential to play for the national team, we see if they are willing to do that.

The last group you mentioned is the controversial one…

It’s very simple - just look at Alexander Duric. He is the oldest player playing for Singapore and has already been here six or seven years. He himself asked for a passport, he wants to stay in Singapore. After he received the passport, I choose players that are available. He is 37 and wants to play for the national team for one year or six months.

We are not just focusing on foreigners. If you look at the Under-23 team they played at the recent SEA Games and there was only one foreigner. All the foreigners are helping the development of young players in Singapore.

Singapore has had good results in past years, better than much bigger countries like Thailand and Indonesia. Why is this?

In my case it is very simple. It is just direction and hard work.

Can Singapore move to the next level from being a good SE Asian team to become a good Asian team?

It’s possible but it’s too early to say at the moment. To go to the next level there must be changes in many areas –from facilities to a change in the way of thinking. That’s the hardest part. The beginning of professionalism is here, in the league and clubs, and if that part improves, if the clubs improve, that will reflect on the national team as well and help us to achieve more.

Singaporeans are well-known for their love of English football. Is that a problem for the national team?

I am sometimes fed up with that! (laughs) If you look at the bars and coffee shops you can see people watching the Premier League on big screens. In some ways, it is good for the general atmosphere of football but if those people spent 50% of that effort supporting local teams or the national teams then things would be better for us.

Your opening World Cup qualification game is a tough one – away at Saudi Arabia. How will you approach that game? Will you settle for a point?

I play every game to win. If you go with the intention of drawing – that is not my way, whether it is against Saudi Arabia, England, Myanmar or Laos. Sometimes we go six months without a game so when we do have a game and we don’t go out to win that game then there is something wrong.

Is your group one of the more difficult ones?

Yes, it is a difficult group. Saudi Arabia have a lot of advantages over us. The first is the quality that they have. Second, is that they are in the middle of their season and they are in competition form. Our league has finished and we have to build towards the game. I don’t think we can be in great competition form in that short period of time but we will try our best.

Are you playing for second place with Uzbekistan and Lebanon?

It doesn’t matter if we finish first or second. Everybody has the same ambition as us and that is to go into the next round. I am watching tapes of the Saudi Arabia now and sure, they are big favourites but you have to adapt to playing against them.

Singapore striker Noh Alam Shah was banned for one year by the Singapore FA for attacking Daniel Bennett in the Singapore Cup final. He can, however, play for the national team. Will you select him when he recovers from injury?

He is a big part of this team. With him in the team we have had good results and he is a big part of the team. He is the kind of player who gives 100% every game and all last season he had the handicap of playing injured. He was taking painkillers before every game.

What happened in the cup doesn’t happen often. Nobody approves of what he did but it shouldn’t end his career. I have known him for four years and never had any problems with him.

The incident involved a national team-mate. Will there be no problem in the dressing room between them?

We need time to get together again and see if a problem exists. After the season finished, Alam Shah had an operation and if he wants to play for the national team then he needs to play football. He is banned in Singapore but I hope he will go to Malaysia and we will follow his progress.

If everything is Ok then my intention is to bring them together. Then we will see.

So Bennett and Alam Shah will be OK together you think?

Sure. I have personally known both of them for four years.

Copyright: John Duerden & Soccerphile.com

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Peter Butler - From West Ham To South East Asia

Ex-West Ham and West Brom player Peter Butler is still only 41 years old but he has already coached in five different countries.

After leaving his post as reserve coach of Halifax in 2001, Butler moved to Australia where he worked with Sorrento Soccer Club in Perth. In 2003, the former tough-tackling midfielder took over Malaysian club Sabah before heading to Singapore and eight months as head coach of Singapore Armed Forces. He is now in charge of Indonesian outfit Persiba Balikpapan and he found time to chat.

Your first coaching job was at Halifax?

Yes, I started there. I was at West Brom and wanted to leave and start coaching. It was an opportunity for me to get all my licenses. I enjoyed it. I am from Halifax and I wanted to end my career there. I went there as coach but I ended up playing about 70 games. It was a great experience.

When the manager there was sacked, Paul Bracewell came in and wanted to bring in his own people. That was fair enough. So I thought ‘what do I do now?’ I could have sat on my backside and wait for a nother job –there were offers to stay in England – but then the position in Australia came up.

What was the Australian job?

I was director of an academy at a state league side in Perth. I set up programs there for 11-18 year-olds and it was a great experience. There were some good young kids in the system there. The problem is that at 14-15, they fall out of the system, maybe go on to Aussie Rules Football or something completely different and they are then lost to the game.

Can Australia become a major football power?

I feel that Australia could become a real power in Asia without a doubt. They have the new league set up and they have to give it 5-10 years. Then they can look at leagues like Japan and Korea as models. They have to be patient. A lot of planning and thought has gone into it.

There are some very good players and athletes in Australia but they are always competing against Aussie Rules, Rugby, cricket etc. There is some good stuff going on there at youth level and I have no doubt in the future that they will be a powerhouse.

How was the standard in Australia compared to England’s lower leagues?

It is a difficult question and not really fair to compare. The English lower leagues are very tough. It is all hustle-and-bustle, cut-and-thrust, they are unique in the world of football. Australia was a lot slower but different. The A-League is new but it has potential to be very big.

Moving from England to Australia is perhaps not such a big move culturally but then going from Australia to South-east Asia must have been very different.

It was a big culture shock but i was surprised at how easily I settled and got into it. It was a wonderful learning curve. If you want to test yourself then Asia is a great place to work. I went to East Malaysia and they are great people. They love football.

It seems these days that Malaysian fans love English football and are less interested in their domestic game. Is that correct?

When I was there they were developing the Super League and I took Sabah to the Super League. When I joined Sabah they used to get crowds of 2,000. From the day I went there, we got a lot of success and we got to the cup final and played in front of 80,000.

It was my first season, took them to the Super League and the final and I did it with a team of kids. We went from having crowds of 2,000 to having crowds of 30,000.

Since then, in the past two or three years, I can’t believe how much it has gone downhill. Sponsors have pulled out, there has been a lot of mismanagement, a lot of politicking, politicicians getting involved for their own reasons. Malaysians love football and their domestic football but in the last two or three years, a lot of people have become disillusioned with it.

The Asian Cup was a disaster from a Malaysian point of view…

I took my kids to a game during the Asian Cup but there was nobody there –it was so sad. They have wonderful stadiums, some great people doing some good work there. They need to develop the system slowly and be patient. The big issue in Asia is all about winning a trophy – it’s all win, win, win. They have to lose that mentality and start thinking about development, getting a coach education system in place.

I can actually see Malaysian football coming back domestically in the future irrespective of the failures of the national team at respective international competitions recently in south east asia, but it will take a long time and a lot of hard work from top to bottom. I believe it is good that the government has decided to start taking a closer look at the state of Malaysian football and people should be made accountable for the failures at development level and national level. They need to place people in positions of responsibility with overseas experience who can help the local coaches and educate them with what is going on in the global game.

Then you went to Singapore – a smaller country but with much more success in football.

When I first went there, there were about 1,000 in the stadium again. They love English football in Singapore but they don’t watch their local football. I would say the majority of Chinese/ Singaporeans only go to the stadium not because they are interested in the quality of the football only because they have money on the game.

The Singapore national team coach (Raddy Avramovic) has done a good job. A lot of people are critical that he has allowed four or five overseas players to naturalise and get citizenship. I have seen what the Singapore FA are doing and they are trying.

There is some good stuff going on in Singapore but it is a non-competitive league. Three teams –Home United, Tampines and Singapore Armed Forces – who I was coach of- are in it. Apart from those three, it is by far the weakest league in south-east Asia.

You are only 41 yet have coached in five countries. What kind of coach are you and how have you grown from your experience?

When I started, I wanted to coach in as many countries as I could in order to get experience. From a cultural point of view, you have to embrace their culture and throw yourself into it. I think I am far from a typical English coach. I have a very open mind. You have to learn how to deal with difficult people and you must improvise. Improvisation is the key to working in this part of the world. You have to be flexible – if you are stubborn, you have no chance of success. I learned that the hard way and it has not only made me a better coach but it has also made me a better person.

Can you give an example of a football cultural difference?

Well, there are presidents calling you on the bench telling you to change the team (laughs). It is knowing how far you can push the players. Getting Malayisans in in the morning for strength and conditioning work and then getting them in the afternoon and doing ball work in the afternoon. You have to gain their trust and show them the reason why they are doing it.

If you do that in Australia or England then it is no problem, they’ll do it, they want to get stronger and fitter. In Malaysia you have to cajole them and show they why they should do it. Indonesians are a little different, they want to work. If you get them up at seven in the morning and get they in the gym, they’ll be there.

I have taken a lot of things from Indonesia and Malaysia and have adopted them into my personality. I learn things from then. You can’t rant and rave at the players. You lose a lot of face by shouting. I don’t, I talk to them and get them believing in what we are doing and trusting me. I am like a father figure to them.

If you were to coach in England again, what kind of things would you take from Asia as a coach?

I would take a great deal. Things such as being patient, putting things in place and developing slowly.

Now you are in Indonesia. Some say that potentially, Indonesia is the strongest SE Asian nation. Would you agree with that?

Without a doubt. Some of the players I work with are very talented and could move on to play in different leagues. I am not saying that they are ready for Europe as I don’t think they are. They have to become stronger mentally. People talk about their physique but I don’t think that is such a big handicap. There are some strong Indonesian boys. I think you can overcome that. They have a willingness to work and potentially I can see the potential in Indonesia is massive.

Last week, we lost a league game in front of 45,000 people. I said to my assistant that ‘this is just like England.’ Indonesians are always singing, they never stop. That club is a big one, while mine is small but I thought they if you could bottle this atmosphere and take it back to the UK well…

I got a taste of that during the Asian Cup in Jakarta. The atmosphere was fantastic.

The clubs are like that too.

So then why isn’t Indonesia better? What’s the problem?

First, they have to get a coach education program. The Vision Asia project is a great idea through the AFC. They have to be willing to change and not be afraid of change. They have to be willing for some people to step aside to let things move forward. There are no real development programs. Most of these kids haven’t been coached. Indonesian coaches don’t really coach the youngsters, they just let them play. Sometimes that is great and kids can express themselves.

In the UK, we got to a stage where kids are being overcoached. There are more programs than ever in the British system but we don’t produce any better players than we did 15 or 20 years ago with the old apprentice scheme.

When Howard Wilkinson introduced the Charter for Quality, I could see there were going to be problems. We have created a monster. Kids now at 16,17 etc are earning 10,000 pounds a week. They are spoiled. We produce kids now without that hunger and passion. This charter for quality means that kids no longer do the menial jobs like cleaning the dressing room etc. Kids in the UK don’t appreciate what they have – fantastic training grounds, food etc

What is your proudest achievement as a coach?

If you’re talking about winning silverware then I haven’t really won any. I have always joined clubs who wanted to construct a new team. I have never joined a team with stars, they have always been mid-table or at the bottom and I have taken them up.

At every club, I have always brought in young players. At Sabah, I brought in six young lads. I am a big believer in giving youth a chance. Taking Sabah into the Super League and the Malaysian Cup final was a big achievement as we were punching above our weight. We had no stars. At Singapore, I was there for eight months and we were top of the league. I resigned because of interference from the general manager there.

Here, I have brought in a lot of young lads. You don’t always measure success by wining trophies but by building a team for the future.

What are your future plans?

I want to stay in Asia or go to the Middle-East. I like working in this region. I am ambitious and I would like to take on a new challenge – perhaps West Asia or Japan, Korea and China

Copyright: John Duerden & Soccerphile.com

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